That's just up the road from Domaine Drouhin and I can already picture the fertlizers and pesticides leaching into some of the finest grape-growing soil around. Gotta have those manicured lawns though.

While its been fun watching the industry grow, and the tasting rooms moved out of garages, there's something sad about all this, sorta like kids growing up and out. I don't begrudge the folks their luxe hotel --though neighboring Domaine Serene's $200 Pinots are ridiculous-- but save the good land for the grapes, and put the resorts on the valley floor.

Are there "manicured lawns" in the plan? I haven't seen it. Last time I looked, grape growing, especially in Oregon, usually involves chemical use at a higher rate than landscaping of most sorts. I'd be surprised if the new "joint" will create a net increase in chemicals "...leaching into some of the finest grape-growing soil around."

Of course, there'd be just as many objections to such a resort on the valley floor, probably from the same folks, for the same reasons.

It is sad, though, to have lived long enough to watch the birth and death of the small scale wine industry here. Dick Erath just sold out to Ste. Michelle. It ain't ever gonna be the same.

IMO the development is as good as approved. In most jurisdictions even the hint of a M-37 claim is enough to make the decision-makers bend. This is only the beginning of what is going to happen in formerly protected farm/forest areas.

Looks like a great idea to me. It'll be an excellent addition to the wine country's attractions, and will help attract tourists who want to stay awhile.

Are there "manicured lawns" in the plan? I haven't seen it. Last time I looked, grape growing, especially in Oregon, usually involves chemical use at a higher rate than landscaping of most sorts.

I haven't seen any plans and was just hypothesizing. I can't imagine a giant hotel without a huge spread of lawn. Anyway most Oregon wineries have moved or are moving toward organic production; better for the grapes, wine, and long term health of the land.

As for the tourists, you can rent Red Ridge Farms just down the road for the night. Youngberg Hill, further west, has a half dozen rooms or so with a drop-dead view of the valley. We've stayed at both places. The Hotel Oregon in downtown McMinnville is lots of fun.

The rolling hills at night will be different with the activities, lights, traffic of a resort. If folks want Napa, they should go to Napa. Oregon Pinot is special; why not keep Yamhill County special too? Need a resort, why not downtown Dayton near the Joel Palmer house restaurant? Help build Dayton's tax base, not waste limited agricultural land.

We were talking to the winemaker/owner of Methven Family Vineyards over Memorial Day, who just produced his first wines. (Highly recommended, by the way.) They're further south and a little out of the way and I asked why this location and he said finding available land around Dundee is getting nearly impossible if not prohibitively expensive. Hip Chicks Do Wine in Portland isn't doing any pinot noir this year; couldn't find any available grapes last harvest. Oregon wine country is one of my favorite places in the world. I know it will keep changing, as it has, mostly for the good, over the last twenty-five years I've been enjoying it. But a wine Disneyland we don't need.

Frank Dufay says, "save the good land for the grapes, and put the resorts on the valley floor."

IIRC the valley floor is the good grape land. Teh hills are not. I think a key test would be whether this guy going to rip up vinyards to put in his hotel.

The big diff between this an the Protland model is that this guy doesn't seem to be looking for mega millions in subsidies from Dayton's version of PDC.

And what is the problem with this development again????

I'm not sure that it can so safely assumed that the majority of the locals oppose this.

I don't get the fatalistic negative tone around this. Oregon wine is arriving on the world scene and for the first time since I've been alive in Oregon there is a bright and expanding future for Oregon ag products within a defined nitch. Small scale with high dollar yields plus it attracts tourism - this is a major winner.

Even if you are one of those fuedalistic land-nazi's who wept as M37 passed this is good at increasing land values and promoting hobby-farms in the region to keep with the aesthetics. Projects like this will preserve farm land not deface it - even if its a little hoity-toitery than the your perception of what agriculture should be.

If you have a problem with the hotel take it up to LUBA (1000 Friends Probably will if this plan is that offensive). In reality this will preserve farm land and work to achieve the type of industry Tom McCall sought to preserve with SB100.

Alot better than a subdivision by any means. I'm excited at the prospect wine is offering the economy of Oregon and it fits our state's culture well (be it left or right).

What I meant to say above is, I'm not sure that it can so safely be assumed that the majority of the locals oppose this.

I left out the "be."

Isn't the process of an investor sinking money into a speculative venture, apparently within the defined local rules, the essence of capitalism? Is capitalism only okay if all the neighbors approve?

Not everything that's legal is good.

Gran Turismp: The best land for grapes is on the hills - mostly facing south - good sun, good heat, good drainage. Grapes don't need incredibly good soil. A couple of years ago, I saw some ancient vines in Sion, Switzerland growing on what, to these Oregonian's eyes, looked like cr*p soil. The wine was great.

It's lucky for our pinot industry that hills are good for grapes. When the wine pioneers came here 30 years ago, they weren't the rich folks they have since either become or have been replaced by. They couldn't afford the 'real' farmland that was growing row crops galore, wheat, mint, hops, etc. With the changing economy and labor laws, most of those crops are no longer the big money makers they used to be and lots of land has gone to nursery crops, Christmas trees and grass seed.

Rusty is right - as far as I can tell, most 'locals,' including all the people, mostly vineyard owners, who live on the road to the proposed hotel, oppose it.

To those posters who think we need tourism: There is tons of wine tourism, casino tourism and Air Museum tourism in Yamhill County right now. This hotel won't add much. Also, there are dozens of darling B&Bs scattered throughout the county, in addition to the Oregon Hotel and the more generic hotels. Note to the thrifty: there is no room tax in Yamhill County, except for the statewide 1% and something like 5% or 6% in Newberg.

What Yamhill County residents do fear is that the big hotel's traffic will wreck the narrow, two-lane county road the property is on, what with low-paid employees and high-priced limos expected to arrive; take the last remaining ground water, and bring in people who oppose the ag-practices the wine industry engages in: cannon shots to bother grape-eating birds; pesticide and herbicide sprays, though as an earlier poster noted they are moving toward less-intensive use of these chemicals; and dust.

Another hotel on the valley floor would be in one of the small communities in the county - a welcome addition to their local economy.

I don't know about Dayton, but out here in Washington County we just approved a 2% lodging tax increase specifically to fund more advertising re the wine industry. The tidal wave is coming folks and only M 37 could stop it if some idiot decides to build a subdivision in the middle of a vineyard.

Wine was a $1 billion industry for OR last year, without including the auxillary benefits of increased hotels, restuarants, etc. It is, I believe, the fastest growing major industry in the state.

I sure hope they pay their workers a "living wage" and full benefits. Otherwise Sam Adams and the A.W.M.M. (Anti Wal-Mart Machine) might try and make an example out of them and not hold any Portland sponsored "off-sites" there.

That would be a real shame for everybody involved.

Good soil doesn't mean rich. Stressing the roots brings the best out of the grape, so rocky soil works well. There's a debate whether you irrigate or not, let alone go organic, though nearby Sokol Blosser and Archery Summit have. Mayasara's even "biodynamic" though that's a little too cosmic for me.

The issue is what do we want to see. We could turn those Dundee Hills into suburban sprawl, with housing everywhere the eye can see...like Bull Mountain. We can build the wine industry. We can build the tourist industry. We can throw up "destination resorts" that have little context with their surroundings.

Napa could've been a "bedroom community" of San Francisco, and look like Tigard. Instead, its an important agricultural treasure (despite the occasional pomposity). But, folks, if you want to save good agricultural land...you can't pave it over. And the valley's good for some crops, but wine, not so much. The hills are alive with the sound of pinot...we should try to keep it that way.

Stressing the roots

I mean stresing the vines by making the roots dig deep.

Like most things in life, that which comes easy, isn't quite as good. You've got to work hard at it to be something special. Fortunately, amazingly, in Oregon we've got the trying climate, difficult soil, and a challenging grape in pinot noir...but when it works, we can be world class.

the Trib thinks he walks on water. Maybe I'm missing something.

Before panites get too tightly knotted up, please try to understand [www.oregonwine.org/docs/EISPressRelease.doc].

Finally, a new industry for Oregon truly comes of age. It ain't sawdust...it ain't high tech...it's "ag" baby "ag"....happening on all that "ag" land everyone wants to protect. Let it happen....let it thrive...let it grow...and let Kahn do his thing. Whether it's Erath selling or Kahn building, it's GOOD for the oregon economy.

Now if Salem might just consider responding with something
other than a toll road...bike path?....or light rail???....tram???[rimshot].....so that we might get there and back to enjoy it, and the distribution infrastructure could get in and out to get the
product to market, the industry may just continue to thrive and grow.

The negative pall of this thread is depressing! Try to look economic success in the eye and appreciate it....congratulate it....encourage it.

This is much, much, much more than the Vista House at Crown Point. Try to understand that it's the economy.....and it's good for ALL Oregonians. Trust me.

To ensure that continued growth is possible, Bernau maintains that a number of issues must be considered..."The opportunity is there but we need to protect our valuable land..."

"Protect our valuable land" is from the report referenced. Protect doesn't mean turning valuable, limited, grape-friendly land into resorts.

It's the "ag", baby, "ag."

"Protect doesn't mean turning valuable, limited, grape-friendly land into resorts."

This "resort" (50 rooms is kinda small for a resort by the way)will have a footprint impact no different than any other ag-business. This hotel will likely be no different than the massive and oppulent tasting rooms already in existence at other wineries. It will also serve the entire region as it brings in low-impact high value upper-income tourism to the wineries surrounding all of us in the Willamete Valley.

But of course you may be one of those unrealistic farm advocates who don't undrestand why a farmer needs housing for migrant workers, barns for equipment, office space for management, a loading dock for their operation, and a bigger house for their own family. You would show up and oppose any project that might improve the profitablity of agriculture in the region. Not understanding why farmers need anything other than farm land to suceed.

I ain't crazy about the developement either, but drive down Silverado Road in Napa and that is probably the future. This whole thing started with the concerts out there at the other winery, so blaming Kahn isn't one hundred percent fair.

BTW, hillsides are better for wine grapes since they need good drainage (which clay doesn't have naturally.)

But of course you may be one of those unrealistic farm advocates who don't undrestand why a farmer needs housing for migrant workers, barns for equipment...

You're right. I wasn't being realistic enough to recognize they'd be putting up migrant workers in the resort, putting the de-stemmer in the sauna, and the bottling line in the swimming pool. Silly me!

The negative pall of this thread is depressing! Try to look economic success in the eye and appreciate it....congratulate it....encourage it.

What I find depressing is the fact that much farm and forest land that has been protected for over 30 years is going to be wide open for development. I have only lived in Oregon for 11 1/2 yrs., but I know what we have here now, and I like it.

Hey, it's a Hotel.
Not a hog farm or smelter or, a Beaverton Round.
It won't take Urban Renewal, an LID, county planning staff or bureaucrats playing developers.

Neither will nearly every M37 claim.

What's more important is the abundant land around it.
The bulk of land between the valley and coast represents a massive amount of land of all types the full length of the State.

On any road to the coast one could pick up a Tigard or a Milwaukie and plop it down just about anywhere along the way and it would amount to no more than a dot on a map or a couple minutes driving through it. If it were plopped a mile off the road no one would even notice.

So big deal. The wine county isn't threatened.

This State would be better off creating new communities in the middle of the adundance than Metro's chaos of cramming more where too much already exists.
From Gresham to Hillsboro the worst of the worst bad fit overcrowding, over the past 20 years, has been an outcome of Metro's density at costs mentality.

Jimbo, as a native, 39-year resident of this state, I suggest you take a peak at more than areas adjacent to Portland. There are unbelievably vast, unoccupied sections of Oregon. AAMOF, the southeast corner of Oregon has one of the lowest persons per square mile in the whole 48.

Measure 37 is not going to destroy Oregon's natural areas. That's nothing but hype perpetuated by 1000 fiends of Oregon.

For what it's worth, it's not correct to say that David Kahn is a former basketball executive.

He runs the ownership group that controls four NBDL teams - in Albuquerque, Fort Worth, Tulsa, and Austin.

I suggest you take a peak at more than areas adjacent to Portland. There are unbelievably vast, unoccupied sections of Oregon. AAMOF, the southeast corner of Oregon has one of the lowest persons per square mile in the whole 48.

I have travelled over most of this great state the past 11+ yrs(Up and down Coast Calif-Astoria, Wallowa County, K-Falls). I realize there is plenty of open space that will probably remain open space. California, Colorado, and Texas have plenty of open space too. What I am talking about is the open space we have in the Willamette Valley. I don't need '1000 fiends' to realize I like what we have more than what Denver, Houston, Minneapolis, Milwaukee (name a place) has.

Jim Barta aka jimbo

David said: "Wine was a $1 billion industry for OR last year, without including the auxillary benefits of increased hotels, restuarants, etc. It is, I believe, the fastest growing major industry in the state."

Actually, if you read the press release from the Oregon Wine Board carefully, you will see that that $1 billion figure DID include every auxillary benefit the people that did the report could come up with to get to that fragile $1 billion.

Farm gate income from wine grapes in the state of Oregon totalled $42 million in 2005.

What's more important is the abundant land around it. The bulk of land between the valley and coast represents a massive amount of land of all types the full length of the State.

But you can't grow pinot noir just anywhere. It's not corn. It needs the right amount of sun, breeze, coolness, rain. They don't grow pinot noir in southern Oregon wine country. Too warm. Don't grow it in Washington State...too cool.

Some folks think terroir is BS...but the same grapes can taste different from one part of the vineyard to another, yards away. Just as one day's rainfall at harvest can be devastating.

Oregon isn't Central California. Our speciality is smallish quantities of a difficult, tempermental grape, treated respectfully and limited in where in can be grown.

Yes, Steve, its only a "hotel" --well, a "resort"-- but it can be a threat.

The road up to the proposed site has no sewers. Where does the pollution go from the increased traffic on the roadway...the oil, the particulates, the break asbestos? Downhill to drift off the road onto...Domain Drouhin's land?

You say a mile from Tigard, were it dropped somewhere else, no one would notice it. You need to look up at the sky, the effect on the air. You don't believe that air pollution is real?

What's funny to me is we have the businesses who, presumably, know their business...saying this may not be good for our industry. I'm no winemaker, but I've been around them a long time...and I trust their judgement.

Sure, we want economic development, and ever cooler places to go. But let's not lose sight of what makes this particular piece of earth cool in the first place. Maybe you can build a Tigard anywhere, but there's precious little land that lends itself to pinot noir. When the folks who make some the best of that pinor say this resort may be a problem, I think we owe them a serious listen to.

Frank is right - most Yamhill county winemakers don't welcome this boutique hotel for the ultra-rich, as Mr. Kahn and his people have described it.

Let's put the wine industry in perspective - see my post above, plus the following:

When a wine is released from bond it gets taxed. Winemakers don't remove their wine from bond until it is sold. So far this fiscal year,

Up until and including May 2005, one million gallons of Oregon wine were released from bond.

In all of 2004, 2.2 million gallons of Oregon wine were released from bond in this state.

In all of 2004, 12.3 million gallons of wine both produced instate and imported into Oregon were released from bond.

The value of all agricultural commodities produced in Oregon in 2004 was $4 billion. Compare to wine grapes' $42 million. Most ag products have some value added to them, as do wine grapes, by processing, storing, packaging, transporting and selling.

Why is all this important? It pays to keep things in proportion to their overall importance, and to do that we have to see the big picture.

There are unbelievably vast, unoccupied sections of Oregon.

Well, yeah...something like 94% of the land in this state is unoccupied by people. But everyone freaks out when some guy who lost his ass farming wants to subdivide and build a few homes to cut his losses.

Frank it's the non vineyard land, non wetland, non or lightly forested and non farmland I was talking about. Which their is a simply crazy amount of all over the State.

Take the road from Newport to Corvallis or get off 18 anywhere and it's plentiful land of all types. Plopping few towns here and there, if jobs can be created locally, over time would provide the kind of Oregon livability many people prefer.

However, placing a few facilities in and around the wine country does not mean it is lost.

Any more than a new all season destination resort on Mt. Hood would destroy the mountain or the Cascade range.
It means tourism, jobs and the economy to fund our schools and other vital services.
It also means taking advantage of what Oregon has to offer while at the same time caring for the environment with reasonable considerations.

Oregon is terribly underutilized.

There is plenty of room for more use, enjoyment, and everything that comes with it right along with care and protection for the environment and farming industries.

We have always liked the Columbia gorge but found little selection and virtually no fine places except Skamania Lodge for lodging and dining.

Too bad we would have spent a lot more time and money there over the years.

Not wanting to rough it, backpack or bike around is not a bad thing.

Many people, local and tourists, are more than willing to part with hefty amounts when they venture out on leisure time.
But they need leisure places to go to.

Sorry Jack for changing topics.
I don't know them but what a horrible loss for the Jim Scherzinger family.
I can only hope that there's some way my feeling their pain lessens theirs a bit over time.
God what a nightmare.

Indeed.

Frank it's the non vineyard land, non wetland, non or lightly forested and non farmland I was talking about. Which their is a simply crazy amount of all over the State.

So why turn 72 acres of farmland, in one of the best grape-growing areas in the world --the Dundee Hills-- into a resort?

""So why turn 72 acres of farmland, in one of the best grape-growing areas in the world --the Dundee Hills-- into a resort?""

Why not? There's hardly anything out there for visitors willing to explore, enjoy and spend in the area.
Other than the McMennimans Hotel in downtown Mac, there is just about nothing.

A problem that exists all over Oregon in some of the best locales for tourism and Oregonians to leisure time it.

Not every acre of the Dundee Hills is suitable for grape growing. The terrain and soils vary.

Every acre of the Dundee Hills will not be dedicated solely to grape growing.
That's the folly of your argument.

Every acre of prime farmland in the valley is not
and will never be used for farming.
Countless acres of marginal land laces through all of Oregon including farming areas.

Thousands of acres of the gorge and Mt Hood will never be touched yet more lodging, resorts, with full facilities for tourism would be great.

Many of those wanting to hike or bike the areas would prefer fine amenities at the end of the day. Just as they do in places like Sunriver etc.

There is no reasonable excuse for Oregon not being a much more utilized destination.

We got it all.

With Bandon Dunes golf resort ranking # 2 in the WORLD the proof is there that Oregon has enormous potential. But Oregon's potential is being blocked by false and limited choices that misrepresent both the benefit and cost.

We can have it all.
Hopefully this Hotel will be one more example of it as it's full operation functions with the Dundee Hills wine country thriving more than ever.

Does anybody really believe that the wine country of Yamhill County is ever going to be a destination resort in and of itself? This is a "50-room hotel, spa and restaurant." That's it. It isn't a Disneyland. It's a biggie-sized B&B. And with that it probably stretches the limits to the max of whatever market that exists out there for it.

And with that it probably stretches the limits to the max of whatever market that exists out there for it.

And "640 K ought to be about all the memory anyone would ever need." --Bill Gates

My wife is an event planner, and she runs (among other things) bicycle rides and tours out there in the wine country. She is dumbfounded by the dollars the state spends to bring in tourists without reaping any return since we don't have a sales tax. She's working with a group in Salem to promote bicycle tourism, and the state is spending tons of money in all the wrong places, in her opinion. We spent tons promoting Oregon as a destination in other parts of Oregon. How does intrastate tourism help the state?

Kahn obviously sees a potential market niche out there for increased capacity for tourism in the lower valley. I haven't figured out what, exactly, the downside is to a small hotel sprouting up in the area to serve these wine fans. Even if there were three of these hotels, would the traffic be that bad? An extra 150 cars a day? The coast traffic is far more extensive, don't you think?

It's not a Wal-Mart where you can add 10,000 trips a day to the congestion pattern.

And if Kahn thought the soil would make more money growing grapes than bedding tourists, then wouldn't he have done that?

I just don't see the issue, I guess, other than distaste for change. I agree with Steve. Oregon is underutilized.

"""Does anybody really believe that the wine country of Yamhill County is ever going to be a destination resort in and of itself?"""

No.

You pretty much got it with a biggy-sized B&B.

Which makes it harmless.

What makes me nervous about any industry in this state is the way people tend to get obsessive about it. I gave the O a cautious nod when it declared Oregon's wine industry a success story. Tourism is fine. Wine is better. But we seem to fixate on "The Next Big Thing" rather than foster a healthy competitive economy by encouraging sound regulation and open government. And I think we are waaaaay too dependent on the construction industry, which seems to prevent us from seeing the forest for the trees. A diversified economy where good olds can't run their competitors out on a rail is what we need imho.

There's hardly anything out there for visitors willing to explore, enjoy and spend in the area. Other than the McMennimans Hotel in downtown Mac, there is just about nothing.

Wow. "Just about nothing." Just one of the finest wine-growing regions in the world. Then again, Steve, when we've lunched, while I drank my Oregon Pinot, you were drinking coke. :-)

Even if you don't like wine...how about horseback riding at the Circle M Ranch, where you can fly in for lunch (and many do)?

The Spruce Goose. Antique hunting. The casino. Stage shows. Twenty years of the International Pinot Noir Festival at George Fox, with vintners from around the world. Farmers markets; Nick's Italian Cafe; the new Rambla tapas bar.

One of the best restaurants in the universe at the Joel Palmer House, where a mushroom hater like me learned to appreciate fungi. The Dundee Bistro. Art walks in downtown McMinnville. Live jazz at Sokol Blosser. Concerts at Youngberg Hill, Elk Cove, Duck Pond. Nursery's galore. The Carlton Winemaker's Studio. The newly expanded roof restaurant at the Hotel Oregon.

Nah...nuthin' to do. Might as well pave paradise, put up a parkin' lot.

I love Napa. I know the Silverado Trail as well as my backyard. I asked Anne to marry me at Brix, on our first visit there together. But, ironically, you couldn't build in Napa now what's been proposed to be built on prime grape-growing land in the red hills of Dundee. They've smartened up, realized the value of their land for what makes Napa special. It ain't sheep farming, suburban sprawl, or paving over the hillsides. Or more Auburge de Soleils.

Stoller just opened up a new winery where there used to be a turkey farm. Keeping turkeys out of wine-growing hillsides needs to be the future. There's lots of room for hotels, B&Bs and resorts on the valley floor.

Frank,
I was talking about "lodging".

Nice places for people to stay when enjoying an area whether it be wine country, the Gorge or any other under served area.

My wife and I have toured the wine country and visited many of the places you listed.

We liked the area so much we recently bought a nice rental house in Mac.

Although not a wine drinker I did indulge during our winery tour.
One winery we went to, I thinks it's Pamplin's, has it's facilities, tasting room, etc., on top of a butte with a stunning view. It's a great setup
and it doesn't devour all of the "hillsides" as you worry.

As far as lunch and drinking I've never had any alcohol during the work day my entire 34 years of construction work. Not to say there's anything wrong with your glass of your favorite wine, I just chose not to indulge when I had to go back to work.

But if I did it would be Coors Light.
Quality counts. 8-)

Personally I find DUndee and the surrounding area absolutely beautiful. I welcome any development that preserves farmland in the area. This small hotel will add more value to the land as just what it is. An agricultural area dedicated to producing the most dollars per acre as possible.

I've talked to several wheat farmers in the Hood River and Gorge area and all of them are excited about the potential of grapes for wine. I too see this type of development as great for the preservation of the other beautiful destination outside of Portland I reguarly treck to.

Not all change is bad. Especially change that actually puts revenue into our states as opposed to the Portland style which takes it out.

I welcome any development that preserves farmland in the area.

This development eliminates 72 acres of farmland. Do I undretand you to say, then, you oppose it?