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Wednesday, August 22, 2012

Portland school kids can already get fluoride for free

It says so right here and here.

A daily fluoride tablet program is offered upon request at no cost to schools or families.

But the Admiral has decided that it's going in everybody's water, for the sake of kids' teeth, and so you'll have to waste a year of your life to try to stop him.

Comments (19)

Yep, you can get it free all 170 days of school. The other 195 days of the year you need to make other arrangements.

We give our kids fluoride and hope for the best. I'd be kind of glad if they fluoridated the water like just about every other place I've lived -- I believe it is supposed to work better to get regular mini-"baths" of it than to take a nightly pill, and my older son has been a little cavity-prone -- but I think it is reasonable for it to be a decision that represents the city.

Flouride toothpaste is readily available and cheap. The cost of giving it to everyone who needs it and can't afford it would be peanuts.

There is a sound moral basis for not adding a bioactive substance to our water for medical reasons, and there's certainly a sound basis for opposing fluoridation for economic reasons.

There is no sound scientific basis for believing that fluoridated water has any harmful effects, or for believing that it does not improve dental health.

I just wish the debate centered on the genuine issues of contention and was not pulled into the mud by the paranoid and psuedoscientific complaints of a bunch of fringe health nuts.

Over-fluoridation is clearly bad for your health, and there is disagreement about where the threshold for harm is. In that case, I'd rather make my own choices about fluoride, thank you.

How about letting me make my own choices about pumping my own gas, thank you?

I think that the problem in Portlandia is the absence of fluoridation of the water...maybe the goofy thinking would improve with fluoridation.

The lack of fluoridation might cause kids to grow up to become hipsters living a good life dependent on the government. It causes a dependence on bicycles, trolleys and coffee shops. Dense condo housing without parking is thought to be a good thing.

Prove me wrong. Run a huge test.

Sounds too lame to be real. So I bet it's real.

Whether it's a good idea or a bad idea, something as fundamental as the water we drink shouldn't be modified by lame duck politicians motivated by their declining influence.

If fluoridating our water is supported by the majority of those consuming the water (not just in Portland, but throughout the region), then it can be approved by the next city council...The one that will have sufficient time to gauge the will of all water consumers.

Personally, I would prefer fluoridated water: but I wouldn't be a hurry to support anything Sam Adams and Randy Leonard wish to accomplish in their last few months in office. Their motivations are never pure.

Are Harvard medical school researchers paranoid?

I don't think so.

Harvard study: "The children in high fluoride areas had significantly lower IQ than those who lived in low fluoride areas," noted the Harvard research scientists about the results of their study, echoing claims by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) that there is substantial evidence of developmental neurotoxicity associated with the chemical. “The results support the possibility of an adverse effect of high fluoride exposure on children’s neurodevelopment.”

"Fluoride readily crosses the placenta,” they observed. “Fluoride exposure to the developing brain, which is much more susceptible to injury caused by toxicants than is the mature brain, may possibly lead to damage of a permanent nature."

STOP with the charges of being paranoid.

This isn't the only study which states floride is not healthy.

Now you might disagree, but to call opponents of floridation paranoid is intellectually dishonest.

“Fluoride seems to fit in with lead, mercury, and other poisons that cause chemical brain drain,” noted senior study author Philippe Grandjean, a professor of environmental health at Harvard. “The effect of each toxicant may seem small, but the combined damage on a population scale can be serious, especially because the brain power of the next generation is crucial to all of us.”

The Harvard study is not the first to document the toxic effects of fluoride on the human brain. Two dozen studies documented the dangers of floride, scientists and experts are speaking out about the dangers of fluoridation.

Enough I say with the charges of "paranoia".

How many studies do you want?

Or do you already have brain damage and just want to make sure everybody else is like you, so you aren't at a disadvantage?

Seriously, the studies are out there in the public domain, do your own research.

zach wrote: "I just wish the debate centered on the genuine issues of contention and was not pulled into the mud by the paranoid and psuedoscientific complaints of a bunch of fringe health nuts."

It seems you are the one who is uniformed.

Better read the Harvard study, a peer-reviewed study and published in the journal Environmental Health Perspectives of the U.S. National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences on July 20, 2012.

And, yes, this is not the only study which comes to the same conclusion: Floride is not healthy.

The science is out there zach, but given your comment, apparently you are content to put your head in the sand via wilful ignorance and then you call people "fringe health nuts" who actually are informed by scientific studies and therefore reject having a known and proven neurotoxin added to their water.

That kind of ad hominem argument won't cut it this time around.

For myself, facts & evidence are what counts.

Are facts & evidence important to you, zach?

What a sad battle, especially since Portland has been through this already. The science remains the same on this one and only continues to support the fact that fluoride should be a personal choice.

The Pacific Northwest is Salmon Nation. On April 11, 2001, Dr. Paul Engelking, a much needed voice for the salmon, and a Professor of Chemistry at the University of Oregon wrote this:

To: Senate Health and Human Services Re: SB 99
SB 99 uniformly demands fluoride be added to public water supplies, without consideration of local conditions that might make this unwise.
One condition that may make this unwise is the effect on the aquatic communities of all of this fluoride passing into the natural waters of Oregon."

This isn't about the children, and it will harm the salmon.

I just wish the debate centered on the genuine issues of contention and was not pulled into the mud by the paranoid and psuedoscientific complaints of a bunch of fringe health nuts.

I don't think you could characterize this union of scientists as a bunch of fringe health nuts.
Read why they oppose fluoride.

The following documents why our union, formerly National Federation of Federal Employees Local 2050 and since April 1998 Chapter 280 of the National Treasury Employees Union, took the stand it did opposing fluoridation of drinking water supplies. Our union is comprised of and represents the approximately 1500 scientists, lawyers, engineers and other professional employees at EPA Headquarters here in Washington, D.C.

Charging people with "paranoia" is a variant on the "you are a racist" strategy. It's designed to stop the discussion, not further a dialogue.

I can't predict what will ultimately happen, but I think this "you are paranoid" tactic will crash & burn.

And identify its practictioners as unserious, not able to deal in facts & evidence, and tag then as intellectually dishonest.

These are the bullies who rely on cheap shots, not reasoned argument.

Their opinion will not be be listened to.

Remember who uses this epithet.

The Oregonian has already brought out this strategy in their first (or was it second) editorial in support of floridation.

I think the Oregonian is heading to being an "online only" news source, not a physical paper.

You don't keep readers -- paid subscribers -- by insulting their intelligence.

It's a strategy which relies on ignorance.

Fluoride is usually found naturally in low concentration in drinking water and foods.

In some locations, fresh water sources contain dangerously high levels of fluoride, leading to serious health problems.

Dam*ed if you do, and dam*ed if you don't.

It's all about balance. More people are harmed by excess amounts of naturally occurring dihydrogen monoxide, a serious threat to everyone. Yet, useful and necessary when used in moderation.

That said, it seems that there are more important things that our Portland leaders should be worrying about.

General Jack D. Ripper:
Mandrake, do you realize that in addition to fluoridating water, why, there are studies underway to fluoridate salt, flour, fruit juices, soup, sugar, milk... ice cream. Ice cream, Mandrake, children's ice cream.

Major Lionel Mandrake:
Lord, Jack.

Gen. Ripper:
You know when fluoridation first began?

Maj. Mandrake:
I... no, no. I don't, Jack.

Gen. Ripper:
Nineteen hundred and forty-six. 1946, Mandrake. How does that coincide with your post-war Commie conspiracy, huh? It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works.

Maj. Mandrake:
Uh, Jack, Jack, listen... tell me, tell me, Jack. When did you first… become… well, develop this theory?

Gen. Ripper:
[somewhat embarrassed] Well, I, uh... I... I... first became aware of it, Mandrake, during the physical act of love.

Maj. Mandrake:

Gen. Ripper:
Yes, a uh, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I... I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence.

Maj. Mandrake:

Gen. Ripper:
I can assure you it has not recurred, Mandrake. Women uh... women sense my power and they seek the life essence. I, uh... I do not avoid women, Mandrake.

Maj. Mandrake:

Gen. Ripper:
But I... I do deny them my essence.

Adding fluoride to Portland’s water in simple terms is another conspiracy scam from the Sam-Rand twins.

Seems to me to be deflection attempt. What don't they want us to see or read?

That said, it seems that there are more important things
that our Portland leaders should be worrying about.

That may be the tactic then, get the community all in a twist over this fluoride issue, while in "another back room maneuver" there may be even another insidious path they are moving on, but the spotlight will be on where they want it!
There may be more deep financial trouble than they want us to focus on or know about.
Then keeping the people so involved on this while they do what?
Or selling us out in other ways that are harmful to the public and public interest?

If enough cities don't BUY enough hydrofluorosilicic acid to dump in the drinking water supply, the Phosphate Fertilizer industry might have to PAY to have their waste products hauled off to a hazardous waste Arlington.

And THAT'S going to be a cost passed on to the consumer.

I'll bet they'll have to have it hauled away more often that twice a month too!

Kinda like Portland CHARGES people to get rid of their compost...then CHARGES other people to BUY that same compost!


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