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This page contains a single entry from the blog posted on August 21, 2012 2:57 PM. The previous post in this blog was For a wimpy President, a wimpy attorney general. The next post in this blog is Fun Congressional Factoid o' the Day. Many more can be found on the main index page or by looking through the archives.



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Tuesday, August 21, 2012

A visit to the Sam Rand Twins

Comments (37)

I wonder how many secret meetings with the fluoride mafia Sam and Randy had leading up to this? Talk about smoke filled rooms and back room dealing!

I want all of you who were too cool to sign either of those recall petitions (let alone publicly support those campaigns) to reflect on your choice.

The next 132 days are going to be really painful. Then we get a new mayor who won't be much better -- either the lying developer whore or the JFK-in-his-own-mind with the loose screws.

Petition against fluoridation, with lots of supporting background material and excellent citations here.

Who will save the children from the evils of the American Dental Association?!

They're wasting their time trying to talk sense to the Twins. They need to mobilize with a real hard-copy petition to put the matter up for a public vote -- again -- because that's the only way they're going to stop the Fireman.

So at the next "Beervana" Festival, will I be able to order,

"How about a pint of Portlandia hexafluorosilicic acid (H2SiF6) Pale Ale, please?"

"Oh...your out of THAT? Well how about a sodium hexafluorosilicate (Na2SiF6) Porter Stout then?"

Are these some of the same people that rail against vaccinations for children?

You were born with 32 teeth. If you needed lots of teeth, you wouldn't start out with so many....

....Well how about a sodium hexafluorosilicate (Na2SiF6) Porter Stout then?"
Might be good for all to start calling the brewery industry here to let them know we won't want to drink their brews and they need to be on the side of No Fluoride in our water.

I'm surprised that they aren't already opposed to it themselves.

Any idea where they are planning to buy the stuff from? I think I read somewhere that some citys are getting it from China. Any one have firm information about that?

"Are these some of the same people that rail against vaccinations for children?"

They might but that is also a personal health decision.

You might be interested to know that if you give your 2-year olds all the recommended vaccinations, you are exceeding the amount of Aluminum considered safe for children by well over 50 times (1,225 mcg).
The FDA study found that the maximum amount of aluminum an infant could be exposed to over the first year of life would be 4.225 milligrams (mg), based on the recommended schedule of vaccines.

Horse, meet cart. (Yes, both sides can play with this.)

Fluoride and vaccinations for none.
Iodine pills and colonic enemas for all!
Keep Portland weird (and stupid)!
What's science and medicine ever done for anybody.....

Too much fluoride is bad for you. That's science, too.

The amount of floride considered safe has been lowered for children.

Did anybody read the O's editorial in support today?

Paraphrase: "The floride in the saliva will coat the teeth."

It will also "coat" all internal organs including your brain.

Floride is a poison.

You say, "Well, not in small amounts."

I say, "Let's vote on it."

Those Oxford and Cambridge scientists who were good enough sources for Europe and Japan would be good sources in the U.S. if independent science could get press here.

The spill and accidental over-dose risks are interesting to ponder. Who pays for these damages?

The documented risks outweigh benefits.

At some point, we will grow or 3-d construct new teeth.

Until then, dangers to individuals with different tolerances cannot be justified.

We would be pretending to save children who go to bed with sugary liquids against their teeth, while the risks to other populations are well documented.

And the fish did not sign informed consent.

Jack:I'm surprised that they aren't already opposed to it themselves.

So am I.
However, some have approached the brewerys regarding our Bull Run water being seriously degraded by the LT2 rule. There was an interest, but then not the kind of action one would expect from this vital industry in our city. I can only wonder what Leonard and PWB might have told them. Perhaps the brewers were relieved to find that the council went with the lesser of the two, the UV treatment at that time instead of the other large option that was being discussed. I wonder if they understood the UV treatment would have brought about questionable changes in our water as well. They may have been so busy making brews and just dealing with taking care of business that they had no time to sort out details. The Brewers Guild was contacted over a year ago to meet with them, they said they knew what was going on and would not need to meet. So......will be interesting if there will be some action on their part regarding the fluoride issue.

If they think that this will all cool over and people will drink their brews anyway, I for one will look for brews from other areas made without fluoride. I like the micro-brews but honestly, a glass of it made with fluoridated water I simply find repulsive and would not enjoy it. What about those who would claim the brew is organic? I rue the day that Leonard ran us and our water down this path! I hope the community will be able to stop it.

I heard that the breweries have been promised a separate supply of un-fluoridated water, which is why they are silent. But, that is just a rumor, as far as I know. On the other hand, the petition I linked to was promoted by Steinbart's.

For $5 million, we could give out up to 10,000 free dental treatments, at $500 a pop, the benefits of which are evidence-based. Faith in fluoridation, on the other hand, can reasonably be described as "data-resistant".


The O is reporting the floride opponents are going to gather signatures to put a ballot measure to ban floride.


I have been to areas on the east coast where the drinking water is wretched. Portland is fortunate to have crisp, clean drinking water; it would be a shame to resort to bottled H2O in an effort to reduce one more poison that we are exposed to.

I am sure Sam and Randy did quite a bit of research on Wikipedia and informational brochures regarding the topic of fluoridation. Perhaps there vision was obscured by the stacks of $100 bills in front of them.

If the city council forces this poison on us, can we at least waterboard them with it? It can't be torture if it leaves your teeth so pearly white, can it?

Holy crap I can't believe I just used "there" instead of "their". No more fluoride tablets for me. My apologies

Look, I'm not a fan of the way this fluoridation process is being jammed down our throats but there is a lot of misinformation being disseminated by the usual suspects.

Fluoride is poisonous? So is chlorine ammonia, and sodium hydroxide. You know, the other additives in our drinking water.

Claiming that fluoride is going to alter the taste of our water is disingenuous at best and more along the lines of a blatant lie. But go ahead and get your facts from a perfectly neutral source like;jsessionid=A32D9C883A2AEFF3C882FF9E9FEAB470.d03t01?systemMessage=Wiley+Online+Library+will+be+disrupted+on+25+August+from+13%3A00-15%3A00+BST+%2808%3A00-10%3A00+EDT%29+for+essential+maintenance

"It's the water, and a little something more."

As a counter to the argument about the debate issue being loaded against proponents in a debate forum we can start here:

Considering the nature of corporate policies vis-a-vis profits these days, I would turn a baleful eye to proponents from the industries pushing fluoridation.

Due in part to my Jesuit education, here's a logic problem - for those who want their children to consume flouride, one can get a prescription for flouride tablets. (I recall taking these growing up in Idaho, but thanks to genetics, I still have a mouthful of fillings and crowns.) However, COP can pump the chemical into the water supply, but presumably at a far lower level than prescription-required. So, does the much lower level of flouride in the water actually have any beneficial effect?

And, like many others have observed, it sure seems like Randy and Sammy-boy have a lot of last-minute shenanigans up their, well, not their sleeves.

I'm confused, the ADA is a proponent of fluoridation and yet one of the biggest money makers for dentistry is in filling cavities. I'm trying to follow the money but it's leading me to a dead end.

The August 17th Oregonian huge headline "Fluoride backers are smiling" - naturally they are smiling, they just pulled a fast one behind closed doors. Much easier to get three people in line than an entire community.

In my opinion, considering the stealth campaign of behind the doors that have pushed this, there must be a real fear from those who want this so badly, a fear of a public debate and an investigation of what is behind this. What is just as insidious is our council who has betrayed our community, by avoiding a democratic process. They have been lobbied and decided. They won't even go through the pretense of waiting to hear from the public, they have decided before a hearing. It is a complete set up with first hush hush, then rush rush, no wonder the fluoride backers are smiling!

I will add that the irony of this is that it is the proponents of fluoride
who are painting those who don't want fluoride as fearful!

I'm going to believe doctors and dentists and public health professionals regarding the safety and efficacy of drinking-water fluoridation. However, that said, the ambush-style, behind-closed-doors, sneaky way they are trying to implement it in Portland is appalling. Good on the Oregon Citizens for Safe Drinking Water for organizing to put it to a public vote.

So you are going to believe that a dentist is the proper referral for whole body health?

If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. (It doesn't fit!)

Which doctors and dentists and public health professionals are you going to believe?
How about scientists?
"Why EPA Headquarters' Union of Scientists Opposes Fluoridation."

I think that the problem in Portlandia is the absence of fluorine in the water...maybe the goofy thinking would improve with fluoridation. The lack of fluoridation might cause people to become hipsters living a good life dependent on the government. It causes a dependence on bicycles and coffee shops. Prove me wrong. Run a huge test.

I'm trying to follow the money but it's leading me to a dead end.

Try another path!

Speaking of beer, on Friday, the Oregonian printed a letter from Alex Ganum, owner of Upright Brewery, talking about how fluoride would do no damage to beer. The O mentioned where he works, but they did not mention that his brewery is in the same building as Upstream Public Health (running the fluoride campaign), or that he has close personal relationships with the Upstream leadership. Typical shoddy journalism by the Big Zero.


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