I thought the discrimination thing was because you cant be promoted to management unless you start in the shop, and women dont apply for those jobs, so they filed a discrimination complaint.

"Flats fixed free for lady drivers."

I always hated the sexist, discriminatory practices of Les Schwab.

I even claimed that I drove like a lady driver, but nope, no flats fixed free for me!

"Free beef!" What about vegans?
The discrimination!!

I wonder what Les does for bisexuals with flat tires?

Perhaps they fix the leak but they need to blow it up themselves?

Aren't bisexuals usually male or female? ;)

Wow. What part of this story don't the previous comment makers get?

Once I stepped into Les Schwab upon arriving in Oregon 15 years ago, I've never gone anywhere else. It made me sad that the business he and his wife built didn't make it to second generation ownership, with both their two (adult) kids preceding them in death and as I understand it, their daughter not having an interest.

I was aware of this lawsuit and am glad it has been settled, and hope to see women gain more opportunities into their workplace.

"Flats fixed free for lady drivers."

Hmm, over the years, not once have I been charged for a flat repair. Even for tires I didnt buy there.

Schwabs sells cheap chinese made tires, wheels and batteries at outrgeous prices. Good luck on having them stand by their product. It used to be a decent tire shop when Les was alive and Phil was the president. Now its a joke.

I thought equal pay and opportunities means equal responsibilities? How many guys worked in offices where the guys were routinely asked to do the heavy work including moving furniture?

Never once did I see a woman ask another woman for help. It was always asking the guy to do the heavy work...

I even had an experience at a Les Schwab store where the female service desk person asked me to get down the tire chains I bought because they were too heavy for her to lift off the shelf..

I was a loyal customer until they sold me calipers I most likely didn't need and then installed them incorrectly at the SE Powell store.

This story isn't winning me back either.

Hmm, over the years, not once have I been charged for a flat repair. Even for tires I didnt buy there.

Same here. I'm a woman, but many of my guy friends say the same thing and I've never heard anyone at Schwab say it was free only for ladies.

Machine: Sorry to tell you but Goodyear, Costco, Tire Rack and Americaa's Tire Store, etc. all sell the same type made-in-China stuff. You can still buy good American and Canadian built tires and wheels - just do don't look for the cheapest items on sale, since they are usually garbage anyway.

The guys at Les Schwab do back breaking work, in all kinds of weather conditions and they really hustle, too. Now----why wouldn't a woman be able to do the same thing? Incomprehensible. Thank you, US Federal government, for protecting the rights of all of us....and interfering with the privilege of Les Schwab to operate their business in the way that they deem is fair.

Simply amazing. Did some of you even bother reading more about the suit before making up your (very small) minds?

Jack's link didn't work for me (registration required) but a very quick Google search turned up this one: http://www.leagle.com/unsecure/news.do?feed=yellowbrix&storyid=142399582

It says:
---
William Tamayo, regional attorney for the EEOC in Seattle, said the commission determined that more than 200 women should have been hired between 2004 and 2007, the period of investigation. They included a woman who had worked at a Wal-Mart tire center and another who had been an Army helicopter mechanic, Tamayo said.

"Some women never got interviewed, while in other cases, men with no relevant experience were hired," he said.

[B]ecause the company persistently engaged in discriminatory hiring practices... women were denied Les Schwab management jobs because sales and service experience was a prerequisite for promotion.
----

Get it? Qualified women couldn't even get an interview while unqualified men were hired for SALES (which requires very little physical strength, to my knowledge) and service positions. Furthermore, you can't be a manager without experience in those positions. It was a double-whammy, which is why the EEOC went after them so vehemently. They discovered the one while investigating the other.

I thought equal pay and opportunities means equal responsibilities?

It does. No one was looking for a free ride.

Never once did I see a woman ask another woman for help.

Never? What do you think we do when there's no men around? Shrivel up and die?

The guys at Les Schwab do back breaking work, in all kinds of weather conditions and they really hustle, too. Now----why wouldn't a woman be able to do the same thing?

Some women can do it - and want to - and some can't. There are some women who can throw any number of men around - why generalize so? No one is saying that they HAVE to give that job to a 98 lb. waif just because she's a girl, sheesh.

FYI - Equal OPPORTUNITY is not the same as Affirmative Action.

Are you guys stuck in the 50's, or what? We womenfolk do all sorts of things now that you used to protect our tender sensibilities from.

Bartender? What poster are you referring to? Just curious?

"Are you guys stuck in the 50's, or what? We womenfolk do all sorts of things now that you used to protect our tender sensibilities from."

Because if Im one of them, I can tell you I support woman as equal players 100% in the workplace... and when they'd ask me to help them move heavy items and then stand there and watch as I observed many times, I eventually got to the point where Id say "no.. do it yourself or ask a woman to help you." Is there something wrong
with my original response Bartender? Isn't it really in support of treating woman equally? And aren't woman often times the ones guilty of stereotyping and not treating their male co-workers as equals?

In the real workplace men don't have the option you noted.."Some women can do it - and want to - and some can't. ". Men are expected to do what their male piers can do? Do you see my point?

Bartender, oh the irony. You tell lies, and you benefit from a double standard, and men are the anachronism? Riiiggghhhtt. Tell me something Bartender, who changes your 156lb. half-barrels of beer? Who takes cases of liquor and bottled beer, pop, malt-liquor, and other spirits from storage to your bar? Do you work past 10:00 p.m. by yourself, or are you accompanied by male coworkers for 'security'? Do you know that there used to be a city-ordinance prohibiting female employees from working independently past 9:00 p.m. in this city?

Lady, you only exist as the result of a double-standard that works in YOUR favor! You can undoubtedly pour drinks but you can't do the rest of your job without the help of a man who will make only an hourly wage.

These so-called tire-changers are required by company policy to 'run' while moving. Failure to do so results in demerits. This is draconian beyond all-belief. Furthermore, there is also a 'clean cut' mandate, true discrimination against men as women don't tend to grow beards, yet it is the couple of gals that we are going to hear about, not the men suffering under abhorrent working conditions. Oh yeah, poor women.

Plus too, your lady-helicopter-pilot got that job handed to her, doesn't count. Oh yeah, the lady working the tire-center at WalMart probably girl-bullied her way into her position using the same tired anti-male rhetoric you just did. What is this evidence of other than for a double-standard which benefits women at the expense of men?

Equal means the same, lady, and men and women are not the same. I'd be all-for a practical division of labor, but no. Instead I will continue to be punished, held-back, unfairly impeded, and MADE the same/equal to you. At Les Schwab men are forced to scrape their face daily, and be inspected, women aren't. These tire-changer jobs are dirty, out in the weather, and extremely physical while the female employees at 'Schwab enjoy climate control, and paper-work. Males there are expected to be competitive, and must show that style of initiative to get promoted, while apparently all the women have to do is hire a judge.

This should have been an opportunity to address the draconian, abhorrent, working conditions at that company, instead it's another anti-male fest. Jeezus lady, if you're so damn equal why do you need a court, a judge, and ostensibly an Army National Guard armed with Colt M14As pointed at my head, to get your way?

In the real workplace men don't have the option you noted.."Some women can do it - and want to - and some can't. ". Men are expected to do what their male piers can do? Do you see my point?

Huh?

Men most certainly can too apply for these jobs - or not - just like women should be able to. So yes, of course, men have the same "option" I noted because some men can do it - and want to - and some can't.

Again, no one is saying they HAVE to give a job like this (or any other) to someone physically (or otherwise) unable to perform the duties required - male or female. No one is saying that women should get equal pay or job opportunities without doing the same work as their counterparts in the same position. That is not what this case is about. These women were not asking for special consideration or for lesser job duties. They WERE willing to do what their male peers do. Do YOU see the point?

Was moving furniture and other heavy items without assistance a posted requirement in order to be hired in your office? I really doubt it, but if it was, then you'd have every right to your position. But if it wasn't, it sounds like everyone in the office - male and female alike - have every right to refuse and/or seek assistance of some sort.

Afterall, we don't ask hospital orderlies to operate on people. We don't expect pilots to move pianos. Why should an office worker be required to move heavy objects if it's not part of the job description? I'm sorry, but it's a ridiculous analogy.

And yes, Robert, I'm sure women are "often times the ones guilty of stereotyping and not treating their male co-workers as equals." That's just as bad as the other way around.

As an aside, I often work with an all-female staff. We don't just stand there, throwing our hands up, when it comes time to change a keg, for instance, (which in my establishment means taking a full keg from the outside walk-in cooler and moving it about 300 yards to the bar, then lifting it up and back 6" into the cooler - no easy feat). We work together.

Usually though, a big, male customer will OFFER to help, thankfully. Just like I'd help anyone (male or female) struggling with something if I were able. It's the decent thing to do. I'm sure glad I don't live in your bitter, little world.

There is absolutely no correlation between having the physical strength necessary to change out tires and wheels all day long and an aptitude for management. The problem with Les Schwab's corporate culture is that you have to be a tire grunt before you can be a tire boss, and the perception is that women don't have the capacity to meet the physical demands of being a tire grunt so they aren't considered for management. I'm sure they have their token female manager here and there. All in all it is a pattern of blatant discrimination because women aren't being given opportunities based on the macho BS belief that you need to be a man to run a tire shop.

No Vance, all men are not the anachronism, just some of them commenting here. You see, I try not to make broad generalizations about a whole group or class of people... which is the point.

You know absolutely nothing about me or my job other than what I've posted here. Yet you've declared that I'm a liar who "only exist[s] as the result of a double-standard that works in" my favor. Nice.
How can you make those pronouncements about someone you don't even know? Oh, that's right. You can do it because I'm a woman and all women are the same. And that's all you need to know. Thanks for proving my point.

So Vance, as I stated above, I DO change my own kegs when I have to, using the intelligence I was blessed with to do it however is easiest. Even the apes and other lower animals use tools and cooperation to accomplish things the individual on his own cannot. That means using a hand-truck (duh!) and getting one of my usually female co-workers to help lift it in place.

And though I never ask a customer for help, oftentimes they'll offer, and I accept. Just like my elderly, infirm, male owner used to when he filled in. Just like I helped the really short clerk at the store grab a product high up on a shelf that he couldn't reach the other day. These are far different things than demanding equal pay without doing equal work.

Who takes cases of liquor and bottled beer, pop, malt-liquor, and other spirits from storage to your bar?

ME. No one else. I don't have a bar back - or assistance of any kind in the bar. I do it all baby. Bartender, bar back, baby-sitter, and bouncer. And I'm 130 lbs. and nearly 50.

Yeah,that's right... I said bouncer. I am required by law to maintain order in my establishment, buddy. Get a clue. I'm not going to do it the way some men might - by getting all fierce and up in their faces - but I've never had an altercation in the bar that I couldn't handle on my own.

Do you work past 10:00 p.m. by yourself

Uh, yeah. I have a cook (all female, on my shifts) until about 10pm, then I'm all on my own. I have no security - male or otherwise - and have to close up, do my tills and bookwork (involving thousands of dollars), and leave my very dark and (at that time of night) isolated rural establishment all by my 'lil lonesome.

That's how it's been almost everywhere I've worked. And that's a lot of places in 3 different states over the past 30 years.

Do you know that there used to be a city-ordinance prohibiting female employees from working independently past 9:00 p.m. in this city?

So? There used to be a law prohibiting women from voting too. This is the most inane justification I've heard yet.

You can undoubtedly pour drinks but you can't do the rest of your job without the help of a man who will make only an hourly wage.

Besides being patently false, you have no understanding of the bar and restaurant business if you think the people - almost as often girls as guys - performing the duties of a bar back, (or dishwasher, cook, DJ, bouncer or any other) "make only an hourly wage." In nearly all establishments, servers and bartenders tip out these "helpers" - sometimes at an exactly proscribed rate.

Plus too, your lady-helicopter-pilot got that job handed to her, doesn't count. Oh yeah, the lady working the tire-center at WalMart probably girl-bullied her way into her position using the same tired anti-male rhetoric you just did. What is this evidence of other than for a double-standard which benefits women at the expense of men?

Evidence? LOL!! It's quite humorous to hear you make claims for which you have no proof (lady pilot got the job handed to her, WalMart employee girl-bullied her way in) and then speak of these things as "evidence." They're only evidence of your delusional thought processes. Just cuz you say it, doesn't make it so.

Males there are expected to be competitive, and must show that style of initiative to get promoted, while apparently all the women have to do is hire a judge.

Yeah. That's "ALL" they had to do. Easy-peasey. Sat around eating bon-bons on their pretty little butts while this was being decided for them. Oh, and where can I hire a judge? ;)

Look, if you want to turn this into "an opportunity to address the draconian, abhorrent, working conditions at that company," be my guest. But your obvious wrath and bitterness toward the opposite sex belies your real motivation here. Else you'd be wondering why women would want such a horrible job in the first place. Not bitching about them wanting to relieve your dear male comrades of such a dismal fate.

Please, how is advocating for equal treatment for ALL, "anti-male rhetoric"? I'm not anti-male at all. I love guys. I'm just anti-asshole. Male or female. So if the shoe fits....

I recently bought two tires at Firestone and everything was great. And they also had female workers changing tires, so at least they are in compliance with the law in that respect.

Way to go, Bartender! Not only strong in your job, but well-written and logical as well! (Of course, if we really want to go back in history, men like Vance said we couldn't be writers, because we weren't smart enough to go to school! And, we needed to make lots of babies.)

I hope on one of the infrequent trips I make to a drinking establishment, I cross paths with yours.

Thanks for that ep. But you know, they probably just "girl-bullied" their way in.

And you too, umpire. It would be my pleasure, I'm sure.

Bartender, I don't want to upset you or get into this fantastic fight, but you stated that you have to haul kegs 300 yards. 300 yards is 900 ft, or almost 1/4 of a mile. Is this an exaggeration?

Tell us where this bar is, I'd like to see this discriminatory layout of their facilities. It's probably not to OHSA standards.

My bad. In the heat of my ire, I erred. I should have said 100 yds or 300 ft. I'm not too good at estimating distance, but I imagine it to be about the length of a football field. Probably is even less.

Once it's on the dolly, it's really no big deal to wheel a full keg around if you have a clear path. It's the getting it in and out of the coolers that's the drag. So, I shouldn't have emphasized the distance - especially since I screwed it up so - cuz it doesn't really matter. I can be dramatic at times. Especially when I'm so riled up.

"You see, I try not to make broad generalizations about a whole group or class of people..."

"Are you guys stuck in the 50's, or what?"

"You know absolutely nothing about me or my job other than what I've posted here."

"How can you make those pronouncements about someone you don't even know?"

"I DO change my own kegs when I have to,..."

"But your obvious wrath and bitterness toward the opposite sex belies your real motivation here. Else you'd be wondering why women would want such a horrible job in the first place."

Are you being willfully obtuse Vance, or are you really just not that bright? I'll go slowly. [And I'm truly sorry to everyone else for the tedium. But I really object to repeatedly being called a liar.] 

I am not making broad generalizations about ALL men by saying "you guys." Any size group of two or more men is correctly called "guys," is it not? Since I wrote that bit about being stuck in the 50's immediately after quoting - and replying to - the three statements I found objectionable, it should be rather apparent that I was referring to the TWO guyS who made them. Not the entire male gender. Geez, Vance, project much?

Whatever it is you think you know about me, it's not enough to call me a liar, or to dispute defiantly what MY working conditions or duties are. Not by what's been posted here, you don't. 
[And so what's up with that whole rant about "having lots of information on me" anyway? You've got that creepy stalker vibe going, Vance. Knock it off. And you have the gall to criticize some of us who use a pseudonym.]

As I said earlier, I've been in the bar business 30 years- since I was 19, (which - before you call me a liar again - was the legal drinking age in my home state at the time). Do your superior math skills also insist 22 is more than 30? 

Whatever. Neener, neener, neener. 22 years or 30? Who gives a shit? 5 years in the business is enough to know what's up. Enough to know that women do the job without help from men all the time, anyway. Hell, you could sit in a bar for a couple hours and figure that out. Your contention that they don't is simply absurd. Your insistence that I don't, borders on the pathological. 

Even after 30 years I don't claim to know it all. (Unlike pretentious fakes who use the Google machine to pass off a cut-n-paste treatise on beer and its proper nomenclature as his own.)  

I've worked nearly my whole career in small, mostly rural, mostly blue collar, neighborhood bars. I don't know how to make the latest frou-frou, fad drink they're downing in the Pearl. I've never had the "pleasure" of serving the self-avowed experts debating the merits of the Imperial Pint at a yuppy brew pub. My biggest sellers are currently well vodka and Coors Lite. 

And in every bar I've ever worked, we call that big silver thing full of beer a friggin "keg." And we serve the stuff that comes out of it in a "pounder."   

So jargon counts, huh? I'd love to see you come in to my bar and correct the regulars by telling them that it's properly called a half-barrel when they ask about the keg. LOL! I bet you make a lot in tips with an attitude like that. Personally, they can call it anything they like, as long as we all know what we're talking about.

Which is the crux here. We were all talking about that big heavy silver thing full of beer, Vance - even you. The point was that it was heavy, not what its proper name is.

To then jump on my using the common nomenclature as proof positive that I've never, EVER, in 30 years time on the job, moved a keg, or even changed a tap; nay- never even SEEN the top of a keg, is really pathetic, there Sherlock. Try as you desperately might, you can't prove something you so obviously could not possibly know. Give it up.

And Hello, McFly?? YOU are the one who said the service (tire changers) positions were so bad. I simply quoted yourself back to you. If you can't grasp that concept, and the point I was getting at there, you are beyond hope. Beyond my time and patience to explain, anyway.

I've reiterated endlessly that the women in this case don't want special treatment or to do anything less than their male counterparts.   

I've repeated several times that I  get a coworker (often female) to help lift kegs into the cooler if a customer hasn't already made the offer.

Maybe you don't actually read what I've written before shooting off your ugly mouth and declaring me a liar. Maybe you're reading comprehension is just really piss-poor. Whatever your problem, it's no excuse - you rude, ignorant, little man; so obviously bitter and alone.  

It's the same s**t on the loading dock with an office. A dock full of guys breaking their backs, and the office full of a bunch of fat, litigeous, do-nothings.

It is an exercise in futility to try to reason with an unreasonable man, to use logic with someone so demonstrably illogical, to invest time and effort in a person as intellectually lazy as you, Vance. 
  

I'm done with this. Flame away. I'm really beginning to enjoy watching you play the fool. 
       

At work now. There is no "Half Barrel" printed, embossed or otherwise appearing on the top of a keg - or anywhere else for that matter. Be happy to post pics if I knew how.

I didn't think there was, but I like to check my facts before spewing forth nonsense. Unlike you Vance.