It seems that Hillary and Bill care about themselves more than the USA. They hurt Kerry in 2004, and now, beneath the surface, thhey are trying to hurt Obama. Why are they so bitter after all they have been given?

Clinton superdelegate Governor Kulongoski is too busy presiding over an Oregon "energy summit."

I was once a Clinton fan.

They've disabused me of that waste-of-time.

It seems that Hillary and Bill care about themselves more than the USA.

I would go one further and say ALL politicians are in that position. I am so sick of elections being more about party control and less about the country. Its sickening.

"It seems that Hillary and Bill care about themselves more than the USA."

I trust you are not just now realizing something that some have warned about since 1992.

Hillary badly wants to be the first female President. She never will be if Obama wins this year. She has a better chance if McCain wins, although the electoral college is even more strongly against her in 2012.

If those die-hards are for real, they ought to be old enough to remember that "Clean" Gene McCarthy's hold-outs in '68 gave us Richard Nixon. But they may not be for real anyway, just paid agents of the Karl Rove wing of the Republican Party. Dirty tricks are not new.

The media (especially the conservatives) keep these sore losers whipped into a frenzy. So let me say what most people are thinking: "Please... just shut the **** up already."

If you, as a voter, are stupid enough to think McCain is a comparable alternative to Clinton's campaign, then maybe you ARE perfectly suited for the GOP.

I didn't think the woman was suggesting McCain was a "comparable alternative" to Clinton, and I don't think she was seriously contemplating the idea of voting GOP. She simply inferred that Obama's supporters have not exactly been gracious in victory. But I'm sure she and her fellow Clintonites will feel much better after being called bitter, selfish and stupid.

Maybe someone needs to tell them they're acting like spoiled children. Tantrums aren't flattering...

"... don't think (someone) was seriously contemplating the idea of voting GOP ..."

An increasing many people are seriously thinking about voting for Nader, who is on the ballot in Oregon, and in other states.

A vote for 'Neither of the 2-Party Bums' is NOT an 'automatic' win for one of them. An increasing many people see the Third Option is increasingly viable, and might be at term, fully gestated, the 'water' has broken, and the heir is being delivered.

It's a chicken/egg thing. The more people see this is coming, the more this is coming where people see.

The total of voters willing for a Third Option, is greater than either of the two 2-Party voters.

Consider yourself. ... for example

There's a reason for feminism, and I see it clearly in the form of insults (not just on this blog) offered to Clinton supporters. They're just taking it all too personally (like women do), they're bitter (like women are), they're emotional (like women again), selfish and stupid (women are not fit to rule). Spoiled children (need a man in charge of them, of course), tools of Rove (couldn't possibly have thought up any of these arguments themselves, see "too stupid" above).

I was a hardcore Hillary fan but would never DREAM of voting for McCain. These people are idiots. I just can not imagine risking 4 more years to a right-wing administration. Even more shocking are the women willing to vote for a man who clearly has no respect for a woman's right to choose. Frankly, it's retarded.

I am a lifetime Democrat and supported Hillary. I am not bitter she lost but it is not a lock that I am blindly going to follow the party line and vote for Obama. It is the little things that are going to decide the way I vote.

This morning I read a little article in the paper about a fellow you created some environ friendly campaign buttons that he sold to members of the Oregon delegation. http://www.oregonlive.com/living/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/living/121970851468250.xml&coll=7

It got me thinking about this year’s presidential election. What differences are there really between Obama and McCain?

Will US involvement in Iraqi war end during the next administration? Yes and the outcomes will not be much different for either candidate. Obama will gradually withdraw the troops, declaring that the Iraqis have the situation well in hand, leaving a brigade or two on the ground for their protection. McCain will declare American objectives have been met, gradually withdraw the troops while leaving a brigade or two on the ground for stability.

Which one will be a strong leader in international relations? Let’s put it this way, no matter what happens neither one is going to push the button and nuke the world.

Will the economy recover during the next administration? Regardless of who is elected there are the following events will play out: the housing mortgage market will take its losses and filter through the economy, inflation caused by deficit spending and a weak dollar will continue with middle single digit rates, Unemployment will rise to 7% nationally and energy prices will stabilize because of world wide recession.

Both candidates will propose another tax rebate and extend unemployment benefits. Obama will push for lowering taxes for the poorest that already don’t pay any, and raise taxes on the richest who will find other shelters. The net result is zero. McCain will keep the capital gains tax where it is and start drilling for offshore oil. The net result is zero. The economy will filter itself out and recover by itself as it always does. Our economy is based on consumption. Like it or not that is the reality. If we stop consuming all of us will go broke.

So that brings me to why I am voting for McCain. It is so there is no more federal money to build trolleys we don’t need. It is so we have some one who isn’t influenced by the phony progressives, whose agenda is to tax grocery bags, build bike boxes and tell Americans they can’t consume unless it is only socially and very environmentally responsible and then label all the stuff they want with those labels. It is so I don’t have read any more of this silly green stuff like the guy I mentioned selling buttons (consumption get it, consumption).

Thank you for the Republican mindscrew.

Mr. Benton,

"The poor pay no taxes" was a lie I used to believe when I still lived with my parents listening to Rush on their radio... then I moved out and saw the real world. Shockingly, it did not consist of lazy poor people living it up with big-screen TVs and government checks.

What would you consider "poor"? How about my Safeway worker friend who made $18,000 last year. She pays taxes... as a mater of fact she sold her car and moved into a musty old basement for $250 to pay last year's taxes. Try to picture what $250/mo gets you in Portland.

How about the educated poor. Would you consider someone poor that graduated from college and finds they can only get a retail job? They make enough that they shouldn't be poor, but what about the 30% of there income that goes to student loans and other debt acquired to finish college?

Most importantly, the poor pay a higher regressive tax than any in one particular area: inflation tax. Why do I call inflation a tax? Because it takes away value from people via government sanctioned market action. It's regressive because the poorer you are, the less assets you own to shelter you from inflation. Also, the poor pay a far greater portion of there income towards things that are experiencing the fastest inflation (food, energy, and health care all running at a rate well above 10% per year).

If every tax were factored in (not just income tax), the poor would be found to pay at least as much as the rich.

Annie:

A single person with earnings of $18,000 during 2007 would have a total federal income tax bill of $993.00. Obama pledged to cut those rates by 10%. I believe the $99.00 savings pale in comparison to having opportunity to get a better job and earn more money. I don’t believe in the trickle down theory, and McCain doesn’t either. What this country needs is a lot more economic expansion. How many good paying jobs have the both parties sold down the drain with NAFTA? How many jobs have been lost because of overzealous environmental regulations? How many lost employment opportunities has that hypothetical retail worker with the 30% student loan debt experienced because of this city’s progressive anti business tactics. Do you really believe this nation can survive paying high wages to a few by designing tennis shoes in fancy castle office parks while manufacturing them in China? Do you think that importing hybrid automobiles which offers a few jobs to long shore men, car sales persons and mechanics is a good as building them here?

You guys are both forgetting the payroll taxes: 15% plus on low incomes, and as rudely regressive as they come. Nobody doesn't pay tax, except people rich enough not to have to work.

Benton,

"...get a better job...
I'm sure that'll go over real well when I tell her to. She's been going to interviews off and on for 2 years.

"...hypothetical retail worker..."
She's hypothetical only because she's embarrassed by what a seeming waste of time and money a Biology degree turned out to be, and hasn't given me permission to publicly "out" her failure.

As far as "growing" our way out of it... well, trying to scratch, scrape, borrow and "grow" our way out of every problem is always what leads to the next bubble and crash. For an interesting 3.5 min video on why growth won't keep working, take a look at Growth Vs. Prosperity by Chris Martenson.

Allan L.,

I didn't forget about it, I was just worried about being long-winded. Thanks for filling in.

It is so unbelievably important to being a more equitable system of work-for-pay in this society, and taxes are moving things in the wrong direction. There's a quote Chris Martenson uses that I like:

"An imbalance between rich and poor is the oldest and most fatal ailment of all republics." ~Plutarch

Annie,

I could see a problem if your friend was - as so many are - a liberal-arts degree holder. Biology, however, is a different matter. Has your friend no real world experience to supplement the degree? There are jobs up the wazoo these days for people with biology backgrounds - both private and public-sector hire them by the boatload to deal with "green" issues, environmental analysis, and a host of other concerns.

Max,

That does seem to be the mystery these days...

My friends and I try not to dwell on it too much, 'cause you just end up blaming yourself.

We're all some variety of educated, polite, decent-looking guys and gals with fair-to-middlin' references, no drugs, and clear background checks. And we're left to wonder... is it really that hard to find a good job with benefits, or do I just smell bad?

Don't get me wrong, it's EASY to just be employed; we're not going to starve, but it would be nice to do more than survive. Hubby works for a Multnomah Co. school for $19200/yr gross, but it's not any job we're ever going to be able to buy a house with. At the same time, it's the first time in our lives we've had health insurance, so that's nice.

Common, Annie, I know your feelings.

I graduated from college in 1969 during the Nixon administration with a liberal arts degree and couldn’t find a college degree level job to save my life. I worked for a year in a pallet plant for two bucks an hour. I for a time felt the preceding generation got all the breaks and I got screwed. I didn’t dwell on that thought because it was negative thinking and reinvented myself. I found my calling in sales and made a career out of that. I then again reinvented myself and became and entrepreneur and am a successful business owner. In life one has to adapt and evolve, but for heaven’s sake don’t blame the system and don’t feel sorry for yourself or your friend. You have all the opportunities in the world in America, use the opportunity and don’t feel entitled to anything because you are not.

And conversely, don't REFUSE to blame the system, when in fact it is destroying you. Whether you as a specific target, or you as an instance in a category being destroyed.

There are indeed systemic faults, if not outright vengences, which do destroy people's lives. When it is not the victim's self-making.

Odd that this charge -- the system destroys or denies the individual -- is made against other systems, in other sovereignties, places, and times; and yet, the same accusers of those others, claims being dumb and staying mute of the same of their own situation.

... nor DENY you have received many breaks, favors, special treatments, and random luck along the way -- and you're not so well-off anyway -- for no virtue of you own 'effort' or 'attitude.'

It's such hubris, that you did it all YOURSELF, all you've got, all you've accomplished, your own special 'goodness' and 'just desserts' in life ... such hubris that makes the rest of us puke, and promises and creates your unsympathized ruin.

Tensk:

Did you ever hear the one about the farmer who had years of successive droughts, famine, pestilence and tornadoes that ruined his livelihood and drove him to bankruptcy? He lay prostrate and prayed to the all mighty asking what he had done to deserve such calamity. The heavens opened, lightning flashed, thunder clapped and a voice from above echoed “nothing, but something about you just pisses me off.”

Hillary and Bill gave fine speeches supporting Obama. I was wrong in my prior comment. They were team players.

My friends and I try not to dwell on it too much, 'cause you just end up blaming yourself.

Honestly, if you have a real degree in something biology, and you still cannot get a decent job, WHO'S fault is it really? I mean c'mon...there are people in this country without degrees with their own business...hell, there are people who are coming across our borders without even a high school education that build their own businesses. Its not all about the education.

Myself, all I have is a trade school diploma. I went there to learn how to be a drafter. My first job I made $10/hr. Fifteen years later I am making $27/hr as a drafter. All on my own merit, without a degree, and without "help" from a union.