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This page contains a single entry from the blog posted on November 14, 2006 12:51 PM. The previous post in this blog was Big weekend. The next post in this blog is Small world. Many more can be found on the main index page or by looking through the archives.

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Tuesday, November 14, 2006

Out of control

While we're on the subject of the Portland police, there are several additional fine stories about them in this morning's paper, here, here, and here.

It's all coming together, Mayor -- quite the vision.

Comments (17)

When I read about these incidents this morning I was livid. "Out of control" is right. At what point do we say enough is enough?

Pretty damning stuff. Covers the spectrum of what could be wrong with a police bureau and it's overseer. What more will it take for Portlanders to wake up and demand change? Where is the tipping point?

It'll get worse before it gets better.

Don't forget the pensions that are going to bankrupt the city.

Well, now, we wouldn't want to seem anti-union or anything. The assertion that these poor folks would be anything less than altruistic martyrs ist verboten.

Think third rail.

Be afraid.

PS: That's the new "visit Portland" slogan

In late August, he retired from the disability roll, and he is set to receive a pension of $63,288 a year.

I think that's the avenue through which we get some change around here: all it takes is a 20 second campaign ad during the next election:

"A crooked cop in Portland resigned after he lied about working overtime. But because [insert city official's name here] is in bed with the police union, you'll be paying this officer's pension of $63,288 a year out of your property taxes. Don't like paying the pensions for crooked cops? Vote [insert opponent's name here.]"

Forced to resign? Having his police certification immediately revoked? Facing two years of probation and 100 hours of community service?

Am I the only one now wishing a witness would surface willing to swear that one or more of the officers involved in the death of James Chasse, Jr. had, at some point in the scuffle, asked to see Mr. Chasse's underwear?

What a world...

I thought Oregon was cracking down on panty crime. Sun Ku Kim got 14 years, and those were empty panties.

Maybe Grampy will force Portlanders to wear their underwear on the outside like in Bananas. That will keep any other police from needing to stop and threaten citizens with arrest unless they show them the panties. We have to support our local police.

We do. We pay millions and millions of dollars in legal settlements to those who have been harmed by their personal problems.

(collecting a few points that probably don't belong here, per se)


Sure there will be differences when comparing countries. For example infant mortality in the UK is 5.2 vs 6.5 in this country which is 25% higher. I have no problem with say up to +/-100% in most cases but police "shooting to death" rates that are 20,000% higher (200 times) in this country as compared to most European countries are totally unacceptable, by any standards. Ours and theirs.

---

Regardless whether they have anything really damaging on him or not, Mr. Potter will never be able to go alone on this. The entire council should take a stand here. Like expressing strong displeasure at the present and past police leadership inability to meaningfully reduce PPB death-in-custody rates.

---

There is little that the City can do (save imposing aggressive civilian control over the bureau) to make difference here. There are no more studies to do, training programs to be instituted. The issue is internal culture of the agency and the fact they the legal system permits them to kill and brutalize citizens with total immunity.

The present internal culture of the PPB is basically that of a ghetto gang. In gangs killings are natural, they assert power. No external rules can change the logic of it.

The legal system (statues, people, procedures) that makes it all possible by permitting all those killings/brutality to go unpunished is also likely beyond redemption.

---


As after Kendra I continue to remain totally pessimistic. The Portland police will continue to kill at 200+ civilized countries rates.




---------------
Some people had serious problems with that scene after beating, cops just standing there as nothing has happened. It should help to think of it as a hunting scene, that animal at your feet is just that, an animal that you just hunted down, not a fellow human being that presumably deserves saving. You just stand there quietly enjoying the rest of your adrenaline rush, the rush that always accompany successful hunts.

And pop over to Starbucks for a latte.

I am by no means a cop-hater but this kind of thing makes me very wary to be around them. I should trust them why?

What kind of statistics do we have on this? Are these incidents increasing? Or is it just media coverage? Or is it just me? (And, really, how accurate are the stats?) Maybe we should do some kind of comparison with a similar sized (population and law enforcement) city.

On top of this, what about the 52-year-old guy the cops shot at a motel the other night? It looks like a case of police-assisted suicide.

Should I be wary?

Yes, but do not overdo it. Even at US rates the absolute numbers are quite small, only 7 deaths per million inhabitants per year here in Portland on average. So your chances of following Mr. Chasse are quite small objectively speaking. Prudent people would be advised though to step over to the other side when you see them.

Should I trust the numbers quoted here?

Up to you. I consider British numbers solid, they came from their interior ministry (Home Office) and given the degree of civilian scrutiny of police affairs in UK I would trust them. Post your email if you want a copy of their letter to me.

Informal summary of UK shooting deaths can be seen here:
http://inquest.gn.apc.org/data_deaths_in_police_custody.html

I was unable to obtain official Oregon data (which in itself is quite symptomatic). For 2006 simply check the Oregonian. They claim 4 in Portland (one beating, rest shot to death) and 3 in Washington County (all shot) so far this year.

The long term average can be calculated using info from this site:
http://www.portlandonline.com/auditor/index.cfm?c=27070&. Since this is the civilian city site I consider them reliable.

Portland CopWatch has a summary historical page, http://www.portlandcopwatch.org/listofshootings.html which is what I used.

Given that both Portland and Washington county may be deadlier than other police departments in Oregon comparing UK numbers with ours is somewhat problematic.

Somebody on the state level needs to start collecting these numbers statewide.

Mr. Kulongowski?

Should I be wary?

Yes, but do not overdo it. Even at US rates the absolute numbers are quite small, only 7 deaths per million inhabitants per year here in Portland on average. So your chances of following Mr. Chasse are quite small objectively speaking. Prudent people would be advised though to step over to the other side when you see them.

Should I trust the numbers quoted here?

Up to you. I consider British numbers solid, they came from their interior ministry (Home Office) and given the degree of civilian scrutiny of police affairs in UK I would trust them. Post your email if you want a copy of their letter to me.

Informal summary of UK shooting deaths can be seen here:
http://inquest.gn.apc.org/stats_shootings.html

I was unable to obtain official Oregon data (which in itself is quite symptomatic). For 2006 simply check the Oregonian. They claim 4 in Portland (one beating, rest shot to death) and 3 in Washington County (all shot) so far this year.

The long term average can be calculated using info from this site:
http://www.portlandonline.com/auditor/index.cfm?c=27070&. Since this is the civilian city site I consider them reliable.

Portland CopWatch has a summary historical page, http://www.portlandcopwatch.org/listofshootings.html which is what I used.

Given that both Portland and Washington county may be deadlier than other police departments in Oregon comparing UK numbers with ours is somewhat preliminary.

Somebody on the state level needs to start collecting these numbers statewide.

Mr. Kulongowski?

So how does this comparison with the UK goes again?

Here is another way to look at it. At the long-term UK "shooting to death" rates we should have no more that one (1) death in 7 years in the entire Oregon. What do we actually have is not entirely clear since nobody appears to collect statewide data.

Suffice to say that in 7 year period Portland police shot to death at least 24 people, Washington county likely in excess of 16, the rest of the state an estimated minimum of 20. For the grand total of 60. The actual numbers may however be higher.

Jack --

Going back to your original piece regarding the cops and specifically Sgt. Barton, I wonder just how Barton was so fortunate in his timing to file for disability the day before the PPB was to fire him?

That was just amazingly fortunate timing wasn't it?

Hmmmmm.....wonder who tipped the good sergeant off so that he could get the disability claim just in time so that he could rip off the system?

Anybody at the Lazy O, or "Sleepy Mike" , our intrepid DA, looking into that question? Willle Week, maybe, which actually does some nvestigative reporting. I won't cause anyone reading this to spew coffee on their screen or keyboard by suggesting that the City Council look into how Barton got tipped off by a crony infested, corrupt system

It does put into context Potter's extreme reaction to the feebees looking at City Hall, doesn't it?

Thanks there Nonny Mouse for you insight! I
think it is pass time for the FBI to step in
and conduct a much overdue investigation in2
PPB/PPA and Tom's rather strange manner of
"managerment". The more we look into PPB,
the more questions pop up, as in...WHAT IN
THE HELL IS GOING ON HERE. Thanks for your
willingness to share info/tactics! ((NOTE:
hope the FBI monitors this forum/blog and
they take the hint...hint, hint, hint!!))


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