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This page contains a single entry from the blog posted on May 9, 2004 3:29 PM. The previous post in this blog was A Proclamation. The next post in this blog is The hits just keep on comin'. Many more can be found on the main index page or by looking through the archives.



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Sunday, May 9, 2004

Shock the monkey

An interesting flyer showed up on our doorstep today. The folks who are trying to stop animal experimentation at the "primate center" of Oregon Health and Science University ("The Tram we am") are urging people not to go to OHSU for health care if they can help it. They also urge us to tell the president of OHSU why we're boycotting.

Moreover, these activists suggest that people withhold support from the March of Dimes, which funds some of the primate center's operations.

That sounds a bit extreme. But it looks to me like the situation calls for some light and fresh air. Head over here and here, and start deciding for yourself.

Comments (12)

I wonder if it's dawned on these people that it's awfully hard to stop going to OHSU as there are some things that you can only get there. Some of that is because of those federal dollars they're so insistent are being wasted...

More generally, we have talked about this in my psych classes, in terms of the ethics of research. Most psychologists and plenty of ethicists will tell you that since a lot of the research needs to be done, the choice is between doing the research on animals and on humans--and it's better to do it on the animals.

That being said, it's always been an open secret that OHSU's conditions for their test animals are horrible. They could be less inhumane, assuredly, and I'm not going to defend them.

The problem is that I don't think a general OHSU boycott or calling for the abolition of all animal testing is the solution.

When the hippies volunteer to stand-in for the monkeys, then I will pay attention.

Animal testing seems like a necessary evil.

Along with abortion, war and shopping at Starbucks.

You might consider an alternative phrasing; if the researchers are so confident in their work, they should volunteer to test the products on themselves.

As someone who grew up on a commune, I can attest that we were rather isolated from outide events (deliberately so) and in any case far to occupied with getting the garden tilled and canning produce to spend time demonstrating against animal testing. Unless you equate the lifestyle choice with protesting, which for some it was.

Verde -
By "hippie" I mean the 2004 version. Which is someone who hypothetically espouses the virtues of 60s version, but doesn't have the brass to actually live on a commune. In other words, today's hippies are a bunch of fakers - using the words and shouting the slogans, but not walking-the-walk of a true person who is opposed to [insert topic here].


It is sad how you stereotype a certain group of people because of what you think they believe. Your statement says more about you then it does about "hippies." What is you criteria for who is and who is not a "hippy?" Is there some type of organization you have to join? Or do you merely have to wear Birkenstocks, desire peace, believe in cleaner environment, have a vegetarian or vegan lifestyle and oppose the current power structure? If one of those criteria is missing, are you still a hippy?

Leaving the criteria of hippy aside, what makes you think you know what “hippies” think or believe? Did you take a poll perhaps? Or perhaps you are all knowing, and you can just read people’s thoughts?

I'm tired of hearing ignorant people bashing "hippies."

My use of "hippy" isn't a stereotype. It is a single term used to describe a large group of (according to them) people in somewhat different camps of thought. To clarify my point (with no ill will meant towards those who include themselves amongst the 60s style free-spirits) "hippy" as used by myself is to include the hypocritical folks who:
- complain about animal testing, but gladly use products derived there-from (I speak of medical products)
- complain about gasoline engines, but use one
- complain about gasoline engines, then hold "Critical Mass"-style protests which tie up traffic and waste gasoline for everyone stuck in the illegal traffic tie-up

So no, I don't mean any detriment towards those who follow the original incarnation of the 1960s radicals. Unfortunately for everyone that original school of thought has morphed into the 2004 definition.

What is truly sad is that folks automatically assume that I am talking about them (Verde) or get upset over not-much-at-all (timNE). For those of you who missed it, I was commenting on the original post by Jack. My remarks are discussing the folks who are protesting the hospital and are taking their protest ideas to an extreme that is counter-productive.

Yes, it's unfortunate that my 2004-definition of hippy is not the same as some folks' 1964-definition. No ill will towards the 1960s folks is meant on my part. Please stop reading your personal feelings into this. Unless you are one of the hypocrites I described in the list above - I'm not talking about you.

S-i-J: so why not just call them "hypocrites" instead of using a personal shorthand freighted with sociocultural baggage? If you instead make up an acronym or some sort of distinct neologism, you won't have to put up with people carping about your pejorative use of a non-pejorative term.

Put another way: "hippie" already has a meaning. Redefining the word to mean only negative things is picking a fight. And nobody wants to pick a fight, right?

The term 'hippie' is little used, to my knowledge, by or about those sorts of activists.

And it wasn't coined until '65 and not in common parlance until a couple years after that.

A lot more 'hippies' dressed than acted the part.

Activists (of various sorts) or at the extreme, eco-terrorists, would be a lingo update.

MattW - It's an age issue. The 60-s style-radicals are the minority now. 2004-style hippies encompasss 99% of the "clean environment" crowd. Some are sincere, but some are hypocrites. The unfortunate reality is that the peace&love movement has been high-jacked by folks who are less polite than their original namesakes. I know 2 folks who are honestly 1960s radicals. The rest are folks speaking the words, but going to undesirable extremes.

60's-style radicals have been replaced by the hippies of today. I appreciate that you feel "hippies" should be reserved for folks born before 1950 - but that isn't the case.


You original post was one line and did not express anything but negativity towards "hippie volunteers." And the reader is supposed to get that you meant that the protest tactics are extreme and counter-productive? You have a strange way of communicating your ideas.

I guess that is consistent with you last post though, which I can't totally decipher. If you look at the 60s hippies, the vast majority ended up as baby boomers driving SUVs and selling out the hippie ideals for corporate culture. The 60s hippies were no different from the modern version, which brings us back to my point, which perhaps I did not make clearly due to my Socratic technique.

My original point was that some people are sincere about their beliefs and some are hypocrites. Take any belief and you will find hypocrites as well as those that are sincere. Because one person who espouses an idea is a hypocrite does not mean that everyone who espouses said idea is a hypocrite. This is as true of hippies today as it is of hippies from the 60s. Most of the 60s hippies were just jumping on the bandwagon. Being a hippy was cool in the 60s. Now being a hipster is cool.

Stereotyping is what you are doing when you idealize 60s hippies and demonize 2004 hippies. As usual the reality is more complicated than the oversimplification of stereotyping.

Speaking as someone who has worked at ORPRC, I view the website as distorting facts out of recognition.

The following page is particularly egregious, with a "hall of shame" of principal investigators:

I should note that their work is reviewed by an institutional animal care board as the National Institutes of Health. None of these scientists derive their funding from ORPRC; they have to compete for it with all other scientists in their discipline across the country. If their work was indeed "wasted tax dollars" or "animal cruelty", it would be found out and awfully fast.

Animal research is sad, but necessary. Ultimately, it's them or us.


As a lawyer/blogger, I get
to be a member of:

In Vino Veritas

Lange, Pinot Gris 2015
Kiona, Lemberger 2014
Willamette Valley, Pinot Gris 2015
Aix, Rosé de Provence 2016
MarchigĂĽe, Cabernet 2013
Inazío Irruzola, Getariako Txakolina Rosé 2015
Maso Canali, Pinot Grigio 2015
Campo Viejo, Rioja Reserva 2011
Kirkland, Côtes de Provence Rosé 2016
Cantele, Salice Salentino Reserva 2013
Whispering Angel, Côtes de Provence Rosé 2013
Avissi, Prosecco
Cleto Charli, Lambrusco di Sorbara Secco, Vecchia Modena
Pique Poul, Rosé 2016
Edmunds St. John, Bone-Jolly Rosé 2016
Stoller, Pinot Noir Rosé 2016
Chehalem, Inox Chardonnay 2015
The Four Graces, Pinot Gris 2015
GascĂłn, Colosal Red 2013
Cardwell Hill, Pinot Gris 2015
L'Ecole No. 41, Merlot 2013
Della Terra, Anonymus
Willamette Valley, Dijon Clone Chardonnay 2013
Wraith, Cabernet, Eidolon Estate 2012
Januik, Red 2015
Tomassi, Valpolicella, Rafaél, 2014
Sharecropper's Pinot Noir 2013
Helix, Pomatia Red Blend 2013
La Espera, Cabernet 2011
Campo Viejo, Rioja Reserva 2011
Villa Antinori, Toscana 2013
Locations, Spanish Red Wine
Locations, Argentinian Red Wine
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Shatter, Grenache, Maury 2012
Argyle, Vintage Brut 2011
Abacela, Vintner's Blend #16 Abacela, Fiesta Tempranillo 2014
Benton Hill, Pinot Gris 2015
Primarius, Pinot Gris 2015
Januik, Merlot 2013
Napa Cellars, Cabernet 2013
J. Bookwalter, Protagonist 2012
LAN, Rioja Edicion Limitada 2011
Beaulieu, Cabernet, Rutherford 2009
Denada Cellars, Cabernet, Maipo Valley 2014
MarchigĂĽe, Cabernet, Colchagua Valley 2013
Oberon, Cabernet 2014
Hedges, Red Mountain 2012
Balboa, Rose of Grenache 2015
Ontañón, Rioja Reserva 2015
Three Horse Ranch, Pinot Gris 2014
Archery Summit, Vireton Pinot Gris 2014
Nelms Road, Merlot 2013
Chateau Ste. Michelle, Pinot Gris 2014
Conn Creek, Cabernet, Napa 2012
Conn Creek, Cabernet, Napa 2013
Villa Maria, Sauvignon Blanc 2015
G3, Cabernet 2013
Chateau Smith, Cabernet, Washington State 2014
Abacela, Vintner's Blend #16
Willamette Valley, Rose of Pinot Noir, Whole Clusters 2015
Albero, Bobal Rose 2015
Ca' del Baio Barbaresco Valgrande 2012
Goodfellow, Reserve Pinot Gris, Clover 2014
Lugana, San Benedetto 2014
Wente, Cabernet, Charles Wetmore 2011
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King Estate, Pinot Gris 2015
Adelsheim, Pinot Gris 2015
Trader Joe's, Pinot Gris, Willamette Valley 2015
La Vite Lucente, Toscana Red 2013
St. Francis, Cabernet, Sonoma 2013
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Layer Cake, Shiraz 2013
Desert Wind, Ruah 2011
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Marc Maron - Waiting for the Punch
Phil Stanford - Rose City Vice
Kenneth R. Feinberg - What is Life Worth?
Kent Haruf - Our Souls at Night
Peter Carey - True History of the Kelly Gang
Suzanne Collins - The Hunger Games
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Norm Macdonald - Based on a True Story
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Kathryn Lance - Pandora's Genes
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Jack London - The House of Pride, and Other Tales of Hawaii
Jack Walker - The Extraordinary Rendition of Vincent Dellamaria
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Niccolò Machiavelli - The Prince
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Keith Richards - Life
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Justin Halpern - S#*t My Dad Says
Mark Herrmann - The Curmudgeon's Guide to Practicing Law
Barry Glassner - The Gospel of Food
Phil Stanford - The Peyton-Allan Files
Jesse Katz - The Opposite Field
Evelyn Waugh - Brideshead Revisited
J.K. Rowling - Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone
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Ivan Doig - Bucking the Sun
Penda Diakité - I Lost My Tooth in Africa
Grace Lin - The Year of the Rat
Oscar Hijuelos - Mr. Ives' Christmas
Madeline L'Engle - A Wrinkle in Time
Steven Hart - The Last Three Miles
David Sedaris - Me Talk Pretty One Day
Karen Armstrong - The Spiral Staircase
Charles Larson - The Portland Murders
Adrian Wojnarowski - The Miracle of St. Anthony
William H. Colby - Long Goodbye
Steven D. Stark - Meet the Beatles
Phil Stanford - Portland Confidential
Rick Moody - Garden State
Jonathan Schwartz - All in Good Time
David Sedaris - Dress Your Family in Corduroy and Denim
Anthony Holden - Big Deal
Robert J. Spitzer - The Spirit of Leadership
James McManus - Positively Fifth Street
Jeff Noon - Vurt

Road Work

Miles run year to date: 5
At this date last year: 3
Total run in 2017: 113
In 2016: 155
In 2015: 271
In 2014: 401
In 2013: 257
In 2012: 129
In 2011: 113
In 2010: 125
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In 2004: 204
In 2003: 269

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